Space Strategy.

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Space Strategy.

Postby Silverware » 19 Feb 2012, 21:14

So I'm going back to relook at the space strategy game idea I had awhile ago on here.
I want the universe to be totally player driven and have everything mined/manufactured/destroyed by players.
This has alot of problems, like how do you make the first forge, if a forge requires a forge to make the parts for it.

Simplest option would be a npc or friendly station, but this would quickly form a base where people would gravitate to, and it would be unnatural and unwanted in my vision. Then there is the option of an initial package of equipment allowing a quickstart base to be built, this means that new players can find somewhere hidden and produce their equipment, but it would take them awhile.
It's really only what new players without friends in the game already start with. As people who are invited could be considered local to the area, and given a ship/equipment from a friend.

Any ideas for starting new players into this universe would be greatly appreciated.

But first we need to look at production and manufacturing. How it works, what materials you mine, and refine into what others.



My view currently is that there are 4 basic extractor types, one for each of. Metals, Liquids, Gases, Magma. These produce raw materials which are consumed at separation factories, turning the four bases into eight separated materials.

Metals into Base Metals, and Heavy Metals.
Liquids into Aqueous Liquids, and Ionic Liquids.
Gases into Noble Gases, and Reactive Gases.
Magma into Felsic Magma, and Mafic Magma.

Base Metals, are the standard metals from iron to magnesium, and are used in almost every construction. 9/10 Metals are split into Base Metals.
Heavy Metals, are generally radioactive and otherwise useful for power and advanced components. 1/10 Metals are spit into Heavy Metals.
The split rate is to represent natural rarity of the Heavier metals, this value would be more or less random, and is subject to change.

Aqueous Liquids, are water with impurities mixed in, these can be anything from simply distasteful to actually harmful. 8/10 Liquids split into Aqueous Liquids.
Ionic Liquids, are electrolytic in nature, and primarily used for energy storage. 2/10 Liquids split into Ionic Liquids.
Water once cleaned up is required by all life, from yourself to plants and animals as they are moved between systems or planets.

Noble Gases, are useful for all sorts of high tech equipment, from lasers to... other things... 1/10 Gases are split into Noble Gases.
Reactive Gases, are everything from Oxygen, to Carbon-Monoxide. When refined further produces Air and all manner of useful things. 9/10 Gases are reactive Gases.

Felsic Magma, is high in silica and can be turned into electronic circuits, and other silicon based materials. 4/10 Magma is Felsic.
Mafic Magma, is high in iron, and magnesium, Mafic Magma tends to be used in protective ceramics. 6/10 Magma will be Mafic.


That is how the most basic materials stand at this time. Metals will be the most needed, and will be able to be mined from Asteroids or Planets in very high quantities. Gases would be second most common, then Magma, and finally Liquids as the most rare.

After splitting the base materials into raw materials, you ship them off to the Tier one production lines and churn out things like water, ceramics, and pure metals.
These goto Tier two production lines and produce things like alloys.

Around Tier two you should be able to take amounts of items and produce Tier one, two and three production lines, and splitting facilities.
As things progress you get more and more specialized items, that are required by weaponry, engines, robotics, computers. And eventually you can start producing more useful stuff like lasers.

To produce an item you need to invent it. There are a set number of item types, but once selected the invention gets calculated and you get blueprints for the item. You can copy these blueprints or sell them to others.
Most items have fairly set numbers of specialized items they require but some of the lower tier items are more random. better inventions requiring more, but producing better results.

You will have skills that improve as you use them, so spending time actively inventing new things makes you better at it. While spending time in combat makes you better at combat.
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Re: Space Strategy.

Postby Happy Demon » 20 Feb 2012, 06:00

I'm looking forward to playing something like that, but you should make a playable test version a priority, the earlier we get it, the faster we can smooth the mechanics.
It's all about the glitches and bugs, we need to remove them as soon as possible.

As for beginners, a tutorial would help, make it offline, since if not, then people WILL grief it.
The first type, that should be made by the player, the better the forge, the better the product, so the first forge will be inefficient, but it'll serve it's purpose until replaced.
There should always be a construction capability on the ship, some better than others, but there will always be one.
You could make the most advanced equipment on a ship (provided they have the material and space necessary), but it will take a LOT of time and the product will be of poor quality.

I like your manufacturing idea, it's really good.

I would suggest only Organic (non-humanoid) Space Lifeforms for NPCs.
Yes, I'm suggesting we don't have Space Pirate NPCs, only Space Dragons, Space Bugs, Space Vermin, etc. NPCs.
I think I heard about Space Dragons from a Master of Orion Let's Play.
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Re: Space Strategy.

Postby Silverware » 20 Feb 2012, 09:05

Yeah the space critters are a no-no.
The idea is to make the entire game multiplayer, this does mean that people can grief it. But this is acceptable, as if they are killed it's perma death for their character too.

Maybe new players get a very low quality forge-ship, they could then set up industry on a planet to produce the advanced parts required to produce new ships, items, and even space station modules.

The problem with getting out a playable alpha fast, is that any mistakes in how the database is setup, will be very difficult to fix without rewriting vast sections of the game. I had one where adding just one extra item of information required a rewrite that took several hours, and that was for fairly simple functionality.

A tutorial would definitely be on the cards. And be very important in getting new players up to speed.
I am thinking of making a rogue AI swarm, of small sentient ships to provide some level of NPC aggression, and another method of gaining items. So that combat oriented players are not left out so much. But I am currently unsure of this, as it may prove to be a problem later on.
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Re: Space Strategy.

Postby Happy Demon » 21 Feb 2012, 02:30

You know what? Make the game entirely Multiplayer, no tutorial, since then the Griefers have the greatest ability to grief.
Thus getting a base up and running would be next to impossible, since Pirates will gank you ALL THE TIME!
No, I'm not the Griefing kind of player, I go for protecting others.
People would still try to get a base up and running, since it would be difficult, hardcore gamers love that, since it feels all the better.
Or you could just... you know, make a different server where this is possible (remember that you should set the chance of devastating events (planetary explosion, supernova, nuclear meltdown, etc.) on high, very high).
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Re: Space Strategy.

Postby Silverware » 21 Feb 2012, 16:53

I think further input from you should be ignored HD. =P
The game is going to be entirely MP, and all one server. There will be a tutorial but not an ingame one.
I want to allow people to grief, and allow people to hunt the griefers and kill then, or hire them to grief others.

I am currently looking at how XML formats could be used to store items and materials in easy to read formats, and have the database only remember numbers.
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Re: Space Strategy.

Postby Happy Demon » 22 Feb 2012, 01:57

Okay, I'll just leave this forum then.
Did I mention there's nothing for me to do here? Since my RP kinda crashed, I'll just try to make something that can hold attention next time.
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Re: Space Strategy.

Postby Silverware » 22 Feb 2012, 14:02

I was joking dude, but your input wasn't all that helpful either.
If I started a proper RP on here it would be dead fast too, not from me, but from inactivity from the other members, not your fault.
The idea with this game is not to make it only for hardcore players, but to make it workable for everyone. From day one noobs, to playrs who have been ganking shit for years.
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Space Strategy - Units, Buildings.

Postby ZidaneRobbie » 29 Feb 2012, 22:19

Your strategy game does look a bit good. I do like a bit of developing a base such as that.

Would I help you with thinking of the units, buildings and Support Buildings (defenses etc.)?
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Re: Space Strategy.

Postby Silverware » 02 Mar 2012, 10:17

Currently I need to nail down the raw materials and the initial production line.

I am thinking of making it both more and less complex. less complex production. more complex commands and number of ships and stuff.
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Re: Space Strategy.

Postby Silverware » 18 Mar 2012, 14:00

Two base materials.
Raw Materials. Which is all standard building materials, from metals, to carbon alloys. It can be mined from planets, asteroids, and reclaimed from wrecks.
He-3. The base fuel and power source for ships and planets. It can be extracted from planets, gas giants, and stars.

Components are a category, they are the items that are used to produce more complex systems, modules and ships.
While basic things just require Raw Materials, advanced items require Components.

Planetary building is a mid/early game system of producing goods.
Ships produced are smaller and require large engines to break atmos and escape the gravity well.

Structures for planets and moons are currently:

Mines. requires power, produces raw materials.
He-3 Extractor. requires power, produces He-3.
Solar Powerplant. produces power.
Reactor. requires He-3, produces power.
Factory. produces components or modules, requires power, raw materials, and He-3.
Shipyard. produces ships, requires components, modules, raw materials, power, He-3.
FTL Communications Hub. The uplink the the rest of your bases and ships. Required for a base to function. requires power.
AI Core. A large system of interlinked and networked AI systems. Provides additional CPU for AI functions. requires power.
Research Facility. requires power, AI Core.

Players play as an AI system. Provided with a base ship with, factory, mining, combat, shipyard, AI core, stealth, and research abilities. It is the first ship you have. and if all AI Cores are destroyed you 'die'. When you 'die' all your ships and items are turned into wrecks, and you lose all research, basically resetting to a new character.

Being that you play an AI, stealth in space is possible, so long as your ship is not moving. Stealth means that other ships are unable to find yours. this keeps new players relatively safe, however there are ways to detect stealth ships.

Currently you get to design new ship designs yourself by selecting:

Weapon Type.
Additional systems. ie. Stealth, AI Core

And size of:
Structure
Armor
Hull
Cargo
Warpdrive
Jumpdrive
Engines
Shields
Weapons
Systems

The size of the various systems then gets added together to provide the size of the ship, and then the values of speed and various other things get calculated.
Once you have a design you must spend time researching it, and then produce it.
When produced individual ships get the current scientific advances you have made applied to them, and they can be retrofitted with new advances later for a fraction of the cost of building the ship. Which means you can improve old designs with new technologies.
Its hard for me to explain currently. But i do have a fairly good idea of where this game is going now. =)

And once I have the basic things nailed down further I can start looking at database design. Once thats done actual code can be written =)

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